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#SelfCustody

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I mean, these ain't like in the old days where a few Megabytes got you #Pidgin and other Multi-Protocol Clients of the old days where everyone had to implement bespoke, custom and incompatible and *often completely undocumented, proprietary * protocols like #ICQ, #AIM, #SIPE, etc.

  • Nowadays all these do have some kind of #WebApp or Web Interface one can just login (because *none of them do proper #E2EE with #SelfCustody of all the keys!) so this should be way easier these days: All they do is do HTTP(S) GET/POST so the most critical part is to attain credentials like a #Login #cookie and to basically run a console on i.e. #Firefox to reverse-engineer the #API...
en.wikipedia.orgComparison of cross-platform instant messaging clients - Wikipedia
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@action_jay everything that isn't a fully #OpenSource'd #OpenStandard with #MultiVendor & #MultiProvider support.

That's why @delta (#PGP/MIME) & @monocles / @gajim (#XMPP+#OMEMO) are superior to @signalapp , because that can be easily cracked down on due to #CloudAct, whereas truly #decentralized systems have #SelfCustody so they can't be taken down effectively.

  • Bonus points if they support @torproject / #Tor, cuz that makes it harder for "state-sponsored" (or rather state-endorsed/governmental attackers) to block or sabotage it (#OnionServices are harder to take down!)
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@ejim @ulrichkelber Falsch, denn anders als @signalapp warnen diese davor UND beiten #SelfCustody aller Schlüssel an!

  • Außerdem verlangen;diese keine personenbezogenen Daten wie #Telefonnummer|n welche seit 07/2017 de-jure nicht mehr anonym verfügbar ist und schon zuvor de-facto qua Standortkorrelation nicht anonym war!

infosec.space/@kkarhan/1146959

Infosec.SpaceKevin Karhan :verified: (@kkarhan@infosec.space)@derekmorr@mastodon.social > Let it go, already. No one uses MobileCoin. You can’t even find an exchange to buy it. Then why does @signalapp@mastodon.world still have that shit in it? @Mer__edith@mastodon.world could've pulled that #Shitcoin yet refuses to do do! > The Cloud Act is a non-issue. Signal doesn’t have data on users, so they can’t be forced to disclose it. That's literally wrong! - #Signal not only collects #PII in the form of a #PhoneNumher but explicitly is *able and willing* to use that to dsicriminate against users and restrict app functionality based off their presumed juristiction. There is no *"legitimate interest"* for.doing so nor any legal mandate to do so (unless we excuse the ehole #MobileCoin-#Scam!) > It’s been 30 years, and no one uses xmpp. Let it go. Wrong again. Otherwise there wouldn't be thriving ecosystems and Apps to this day. It's just that corporate shills refuse to acknowledge that Signal - like all centralized, proprietary, #SingleVendor and/or #SingleProvider kessengers before and after - will inevitably die as their business model is not sustainable. Sake with #ICQ really. The only exceptions are those that abolish #privacy for #profit, integrate *actually working payments* or sellout to a #cyberfacist #government (all those apply to #WeChat!) > It’s shocking that people who claim to care about security and privacy push niche apps with terrible UX and no PFS like Delta or XMPP instead of the only private messenger with any real market share, Signal. You know what's shocking to me: People who are unable or rather unwilling.to acknowledge that Signal is garbage and it's requirement for a #PhoneNumber kills any #privacy benefits it may have on paper by virtue of being at best pseudonymous (assuming the userd don't live in a juristiction that demands *"#KYC"* for even prepaid #SIM cards (ime. #Germany) or god forbid even #IMEI|s (i.e. #Turkey has a literal allowlist that'll kick any device off it's MNOs after 90 days within 365 days. - The #UScentric approach to #privacy and #threats makes Signal absolutely useless in many cases, and I do speak here from experience. I'd rather help people onboard #XMPP+#OMEMO like @monocles@monocles.social and/or @gajim@fosstodon.org or #PGP/MIME like @delta@chaos.social & @thunderbird@mastodon.online (incl. setting them up with #Orbot / #TorBrowserBundle / @tails_live@venera.social so their traffic gets through @torproject@mastodon.social and doesn't provide any useable IP addresses. - *I've literally been there and done that!* As for #Sustainability, providers like https://monocles.eu finance themselves by subscriptions (starting at €2 p.m.) which people can pay *fully anonymous* using #CashByMail and #Monero on top of common payment methods (i.e. SEPA wire transfer)... - So even if you think *"#monocles is a #honeypot"* that is mitigateable ciz unlike with Signal you can *choose your own client, choose a different provider & exervise self-custody of all tue keys!*
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@Mer__edith yet @signalapp still demands #PII and refuses to pull out of the #USA putting it's users at risk as per #CloudAct.

youtube.com/watch?v=0DSGq9FQKU4

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@silhouette @richi @signalapp @torproject

1. You completely miss the points! There is no "#TechnicalNecessity" to demand #PII like a #PhoneNumber - espechally for a "#privacy"-focussed messenger!

2. & 3. #Signal is able and willing to comply with #Cyberfacism and pushing a #Shitcoin (#MobileCoin) makes it trivial to criminalize the App for "illegal & unregilated banking". If #Moxie or @Mer__edith cared they'd yeet that thing (or didn't even integrate it to begin with!) to avoid the attention. And yes Signal does restrict the App functionality when using a phone number from #Russia & #Iran (among other nations), thus affecting not only those in need of safe comms but by sending a verification code to them, earmarking them for police & intelligence. Which bings.me to the 1st agrument.

4. #Tor has a stellar record in terms of stability, integrity and censorship circumvention. DIY'ing something instead if following almost two decades of solid progress is absurd and violates "don't roll your own crypto" as a rule!

5. Only with #SelfCustody can you protect your own data. Or do you really expect Staff from Signal to not talk when facing lifetime in jail? If they have the keys, they can decrypt it, thus their #E2EE is just a "#TrustMeBro!" concept. I mean, what prevents them from being forced into backdooring all comms to @icij as per #NSL? Any "guarantee" without self-custody is worthless by virtue of being unenforceable!

Signal pushing #TechPopulism instead of teaching folks that their #ComSec is worth diddly-piss wothout.#OpSec, #InfoSec & #ITsec is dangerous!

  • And yes claiming "JuSt UsE sIgNaL!" is dangerous in the era of #Trump's #cyberfacist regime acting as it does (like with the #ICC)!

Not to mention there are better options that don't do that shite (i.e. demand PII) and just work. @monocles / #monoclesChat & @delta / #deltaChat for example can adapt way better to said risks and ain't run by a #VCmoneyBurningParty!

dumbfuckingweb.sitePost by sleepy silhouette, @silhouette@dumbfuckingweb.site@kkarhan@infosec.space @richi@vmst.io @signalapp@mastodon.world @torproject@mastodon.social >PII afaik the only info is that you have registered to Signal and the last time you've connected. Other services do this too, for technical reasons. >USA irrelevant given the guarantees of their E2...
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@kuketzblog da widerspreche ich vehement.

Es gibt #proprietär|e #Silos welche qua #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider-Aufbau als #InformationBlackhole agieren (u.a. #WhatsApp, #Signal, #Threema, #Session, #Telegram, #discord, …)

und es gibt #OffeneStandards die #Wahlfreiheit zwischen #Clients, #Plattformen, #Servern und #Providern ermöglichen (u.a. #IRC, #Zulip, #RocketChat, ...) und echte #E2EE mit #SelfCustody aller Schlüssel ermöglichen (u.a. #XMPP+#OMEMO & #PGP/MIME)...

Natürlich steht es Menschen frei irgendeinen großen, zentralisierten Anbieter zu nutzen, nur wird dieser am ehesten zur #Enshittification neigen und mit #PII wie #Telefonnummern entsprechende Begierlichkeiten wecken!

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@Linux there are 3 big options you forgot that I know of which too ain't under #Cloudact aka. have no subsidiary/office/parent company in the #USA:

And for #PasswordManagers, there's also #Enpass for those that don't like #KeePassXC / #KeepPassDX / #KeePass and for organizations there's even #Passbolt as a centrally manageable solution. All of these allow #SelfCustody & #SelfHosting on-premise.

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@debby @monocles @Stuxhost well, @delta / #deltaChat is not using #XMPP+#OMEMO (unlike #monoclesChat & #gajim) but #PGP/MIME on regular #eMail, which makes it way easier to setup in organizations as not "yet another server needed" and also easier to comply with mandatory #archival laws in #business use-cases.

docs.monocles.euOverview - monocles Documentation